I've started to write out my plot and I've found I have some questions, so here they are.

I'm writing with a vague ending in mind, one that'll put my tragedy tag into full force while also fulfilling the goal of the story - world domination uniting the world. So, in order to further cement the ending, I want to write out the entire plot to really get a good grasp on the little things that should be included to really flesh it out, like small references and such. This much, I got, but I'm wondering what a good length is.

I've finished writing the first arc out, and it comes to three pages with bare bones and a few major details (and jokes) mixed in. It is hand written, but my handwriting isn't that big and it's a little crammed together with the side notes and such. The first arc is the information gathering arc, the part that will be dedicated to setting up the world and the foundation for the ending. I've completed four things on my plot-to-do in three chapters, but these were pretty small things to get done, future things might span more chapters (like big fight scenes and what not). Note that there's thirty-six major plot-to-dos in the first arc, and those first four don't have any sub-plot-to-dos like many of the others do.

At this rate, this is going to get pretty long, and that's just the first arc!

The second arc is dedicated to growing- strength, power, military, knowledge- as well as further flushing of the world. I haven't got very far into writing this out yet (as I work and sleep most hours of the day away and I started yesterday), but I do have seventeen major plot-to-dos already written, and I've just scratched the surface of all that I want to be included in this arc.

Game plan is 

1. Information Gathering - will show the world and the beginning players, the opposition and create the resolve to take on the journey


2. Growing Might - will be like a level up situation (I mean, there is evolution), be all about the battles and the strengthening of the main party as well as the start of foreshadowing


3. Expanding Territory - will have the mains start going into human society as well as the upper demon world, will be some information collecting but mostly just more world flushing, foreshadowing, and plot progressing. This is where humans will have the biggest part in protag's resolve


4. Tragedy Strikes While the Wound is Fresh - persecution will drive the mains into a desperate situation that right as it seems resolved, will strike again. Will lead mains to have to make some hard decisions about what they really want


5. Betrayal & Decisions (shortest arc) - when the main antagonist reveals themselves and the foreshadowing starts to make sense. Existential crisis ensues, but protag is determined that their way is right


6. The War to End Wars - biggest arc I'm anticipating, mains have to take down all those who oppose their ideals using the only way their enemies know- war. Lots of hoopla, humans and demons, both sides mixed (well, technically three sides but two are fighting for the same thing, they just hate each other)


7. Confrontation - The End (not really an arc, like a two chapters) - will be the final battle and ending, the war is over, the antagonist and protagonist are having final goodbyes, secrets revealed, foreshadowing fully blossoms, and it ends.
   

So you can see that I've got a pretty substantial thing mind-mapped out. 

Do I have too much plot going down? Like what seems unnecessary to you? Should I try to shorten what I got, maybe rearrange some things to make it more manageable for readers to get into? Should arcs be separated into multiple books or can I just keep them all in the same one? Is this too much plot? Did I already say that one? Do you think I'm missing anything? Is anything redundant? I mean, it's a little redundant with all the information gathering but is it too redundant?

Basically, I just want input. What am I doing well, what am I do bad, what could I improve on?

Sorry, this got longer than I anticipated.

Thank you!

I've checked out the first three chapters of Good Demon's War... and I have to say, I'm liking the overall style (minus a couple minor things, but I won't mention those this time). First or third person, I think you could make either perspective work well :P


Progression though, well let's summarize:

Chapter one (reads more like a 'in the void' reincarnation 'start over' prologue):
•We have only an empty void as atmosphere as two beings talk out things. One is just a voice, the other is a figure with several eyes and mouths. (pretty clever way to add in movement I think ;)
•Basically, the only thing I got out of this (relevant to the story) was that the POV character was being 'difficult' -asking simple questions like it had amnesia- and eventually acquires a name (Setia).


Chapter two is where the survival story begins:
•So we meet a second character, an imp, and Setia (with several options) decides to say 'hi' (makes me curious what Setia's previous life was like, which is good!).
•Twas like a role reversal. Suddenly there is another being that is 'difficult' and Setia is the one having to deal with it (kinda the only real source of conflict). Setia gives the imp a name and they talk until the first real danger approaches. They fight the danger and... cliffhanger!

Chapter three:
•the fight continues, the fight ends... then another danger approaches. That fight starts, and end rather quickly, with no seemingly real danger (at least... Setia didn't seem to be in danger with that reaction).
---That was pretty much it for chapter three.
•oh, and the imp (officially) gets a nickname.


•In my opinion, the first chapter wasn't really necessary, I felt it didn't really add much but to show a little of the POV character's amnesia situation and personality. If the void figure returns, then maybe I'd understand... (in chapter two though, the amnesia situation doesn't make any sense to me anymore since answers just pop into Setia's head ~ 'what is this guy? oh! he's a priest!').

•I think chapters two and three could have been mashed together since there is little to no story progression by the end of the third chapter. Together, they could be a good showing of what the characters can do and the whole naming-thing could be over and done with in one chapter.

That's my thinking on chapter progression... aside from that, well, it's rare for me to read everything available, so I guess I enjoyed it to some extent
>_>
<_<

'Chiisutofupuru' pid='828330' dateline='1507310645' Wrote: I've checked out the first three chapters of Good Demon's War... and I have to say, I'm liking the overall style (minus a couple minor things, but I won't mention those this time). First or third person, I think you could make either perspective work well :P


Progression though, well let's summarize:

Chapter one (reads more like a 'in the void' reincarnation 'start over' prologue):
•We have only an empty void as atmosphere as two beings talk out things. One is just a voice, the other is a figure with several eyes and mouths. (pretty clever way to add in movement I think ;)
•Basically, the only thing I got out of this (relevant to the story) was that the POV character was being 'difficult' -asking simple questions like it had amnesia- and eventually acquires a name (Setia).

Chapter two is where the survival story begins:
•So we meet a second character, an imp, and Setia (with several options) decides to say 'hi' (makes me curious what Setia's previous life was like, which is good!).
•Twas like a role reversal. Suddenly there is another being that is 'difficult' and Setia is the one having to deal with it (kinda the only real source of conflict). Setia gives the imp a name and they talk until the first real danger approaches. They fight the danger and... cliffhanger!

Chapter three:
•the fight continues, the fight ends... then another danger approaches. That fight starts, and end rather quickly, with no seemingly real danger (at least... Setia didn't seem to be in danger with that reaction).
---That was pretty much it for chapter three.
•oh, and the imp (officially) gets a nickname.


•In my opinion, the first chapter wasn't really necessary, I felt it didn't really add much but to show a little of the POV character's amnesia situation and personality. If the void figure returns, then maybe I'd understand... (in chapter two though, the amnesia situation doesn't make any sense to me anymore since answers just pop into Setia's head ~ 'what is this guy? oh! he's a priest!').

•I think chapters two and three could have been mashed together since there is little to no story progression by the end of the third chapter. Together, they could be a good showing of what the characters can do and the whole naming-thing could be over and done with in one chapter.

That's my thinking on chapter progression... aside from that, well, it's rare for me to read everything available, so I guess I enjoyed it to some extent
>_>
<_<

Haha, thanks for checking it out.

Chapter one is exactly like start over prologue, isn't it? It's supposed to highlight the concepts that drive Setia, the value of life and the limited time that everything has. As well as the "gift" that Setia gets, the memories. So there was a purpose, even if it wasn't that apparent. I'll work on that some more, making things more easily understandable. I forget that just because I understand, the reader might not, because they don't have all the information.

Chapter two is the introduction to the world and the two main players. The amnesia is resolved at this point, now there's too much information that Setia has to sort through, so not everything is easily accessible. Setia has knowledge from the entire universe, so some of it doesn't apply to the world they're in. I plan to have a sit down soon to sort through all the information that seems applicable. Dela will take part in that.

Chapter three, I understand the lack of danger, I will do better about that. It's my first time writing a fight scene and it was more meant to introduce magic and humans because the next big conflict will have to do with humans as well.

The void figure will return in the end.... like the very end, lol. 

I'm happy you read it all! Thank you very much! I will take this feedback to do better in the future!

Also, quick question, did you find anything remotely humorous? I feel like what I find funny isn't the same as what most would, so I worry that it won't be well recieved because it isn't very funny.

'Chiisutofupuru' pid='828330' dateline='1507310645' Wrote: •In my opinion, the first chapter wasn't really necessary, I felt it didn't really add much but to show a little of the POV character's amnesia situation and personality. If the void figure returns, then maybe I'd understand... (in chapter two though, the amnesia situation doesn't make any sense to me anymore since answers just pop into Setia's head ~ 'what is this guy? oh! he's a priest!').

Disagree. The first chapter was legit as hell, I liked the ruminating tone - sets a standard for the rest of the story. Also it neatly and succinctly explains the backstory - if we started on chapter 2 it would just be 'a weirdly competent(in some ways) / incompetent(in other ways) imp wakes up somewhere - why is it smart? Who knows roll with it!'. Which, I mean, it's not like that couldn't work but it would be a different sort of story I think.

Also I think you missed the part in chapter 1 where the figure shoves a bunch of random knowledge into Setia's head.

Quote:
•I think chapters two and three could have been mashed together since there is little to no story progression by the end of the third chapter. Together, they could be a good showing of what the characters can do and the whole naming-thing could be over and done with in one chapter.

Kind of agree here, but I don't begrudge fleshing things out a bit more by having it split in two - abuse the format with those cliffhangers!

'AnoeticDuckling' pid='828332' dateline='1507315902' Wrote: Also, quick question, did you find anything remotely humorous? I feel like what I find funny isn't the same as what most would, so I worry that it won't be well recieved because it isn't very funny.

Not him but... well we haven't really seen anything funny yet have we? I was mildly amused by some of the back and fourth between characters - but never like laughing out loud. The tone throughout was pretty serious - a few "sigh, I'm dealing with an idiot" moments aside.

...To answer the OP...

'AnoeticDuckling' pid='828323' dateline='1507283302' Wrote: -snip-
I've completed four things on my plot-to-do in three chapters, but these were pretty small things to get done, future things might span more chapters (like big fight scenes and what not). Note that there's thirty-six major plot-to-dos in the first arc, and those first four don't have any sub-plot-to-dos like many of the others do.
-snip-
list of arcs that is 7 things long

So uh... some quick math. 36 things times 7 arcs is 252 things. 4 things in 3 chapters = 189 chapters total. I might have fucked those numbers up but I think it sounds about right. In three chapters you've got 5k~ words = 315k~ words total in 189 chapters. Just... something to keep in mind.

Quote:
So you can see that I've got a pretty substantial thing mind-mapped out. 

Do I have too much plot going down? Like what seems unnecessary to you? Should I try to shorten what I got, maybe rearrange some things to make it more manageable for readers to get into? Should arcs be separated into multiple books or can I just keep them all in the same one? Is this too much plot? Did I already say that one? Do you think I'm missing anything? Is anything redundant? I mean, it's a little redundant with all the information gathering but is it too redundant?

To start with, 315k words is not a perfect number since you noted some arcs will be shorter but I think its a fair starting point. As you pointed out there will be 'sub-points' you want to hit sometimes and whatnot. Is that 'too much'? No. But also probably yes, it is too much for one book. If you had a manuscript already it could probably edited down into 'just' a really long novel - but I would probably split it up if you intend to publish. That said I don't think its overly redundant, maybe arcs two and three could be rolled together - but maybe not, depending on how the story is written.

That's a lot of extrapolation and guesswork though - its really hard to give an sort of opinion one way or another on an 'outline'.

Quote:
Basically, I just want input. What am I doing well, what am I do bad, what could I improve on?

I enjoyed the first few chapters, hooked me fairly well. Biggest improvement would be if there was more to read.

'sinkingship' pid='828346' dateline='1507359391' Wrote: Also I think you missed the part in chapter 1 where the figure shoves a bunch of random knowledge into Setia's head.

You... might be right... (I skimmed the first chapter I think cause I wanted the real story to start XD).
Consider that debate shut down, haha.

'AnoeticDuckling' pid='828323' dateline='1507283302' Wrote: Do I have too much plot going down? Like what seems unnecessary to you? Should I try to shorten what I got, maybe rearrange some things to make it more manageable for readers to get into? Should arcs be separated into multiple books or can I just keep them all in the same one? Is this too much plot? Did I already say that one? Do you think I'm missing anything? Is anything redundant? I mean, it's a little redundant with all the information gathering but is it too redundant?

This is just my opinion so take it with a truckload of salt.
Being afraid that you have too much things going on... Are those things awesome? If yes then that's a very good problem to have. If a certain plot you find unnecessary - your readers will probably think that too. If you have a great idea don't try to "save it for later". Cram all those things in as long as you don't get into the schizophrenic territory of time traveling space ninja pirates who are in love with a vampire girl, but must also find a cure for cancer and win a football tournament.